“Show Notes”
Suzanne has been working for the last 16 years as a personal stylist. Once people find what clothes suit them and work for them, shopping and dressing becomes so much easier. Suzanne was nurse for a while, but decided it wasn’t for her. She then studied fashion and worked for various high street brands. From there she had her own shop. After she closed that business she trained as a stylist and has been working as a stylist ever since. Suzanne’s shop was a ladies accessory shop with a café. Marcus points out that twenty years ago having a café in a shop has ahead of it’s time. She trained and then worked with the House of Colour in Watford. Suzanne says now she tends to work with 40 plus business people. And the proportion of men she is working with is gradually increasing. With lockdown and the use of Zoom men are spending a lot more time looking at themselves and either getting bored with what they see or deciding they want some help with styling. We have spoken to a male stylist Nick Hemms. Suzanne works as a stylist with one photographer in particular, Suzanne Fells. She helps Suzanne’s clients helping them find clothes that are appropriate before a photo shoot. This allows them to arrive at the photo shoot stress free, prepared and more in control. Marcus has asked what Suzanne does if brand colours don’t suit a client going for a brand photoshoot. She says in that case she aims for neutral colours that fit them and the brand. Sam asks how she goes about finding what colours work for people. Suzanne says its about skin tone. She starts with the primary colours, red, yellow and blue. Once she has looked at skin tone and the colours she works out which work best together. Marcus asks how she makes sure that the clothes people where are authentic. Suzanne says it’s a lot about asking lots of questions about there current clothes and lifestyle. And asking lots of questions as people try different clothes. Suzanne has regular photo shoots for her business with Suzanne Fells. Suzanne says that with all of the photos you can ensure you look authentic on social media while using all these new images. Marcus asks Suzanne to share some hints for photographers. Suzanne know how many outfits a client is going to need. Talk to them about ensuring they are clean and ironed and take them I a bag that won’t crease them. Ensure the clients give themselves plenty of time before the shoot to sort their hair and make up. Marcus asks about colours. She says some colours are universal and work well for lots of people like teal and coral. Some light colours can look washed out in photos. Suzanne says dark colours, not necessarily black, give people authority. A jacket also tends to give authority. Suzanne also says those with brighter eyes tend to be able to wear brighter clothes. Suzanne also advices women on make up and hair colour. Marcus points out that we had a whole show about hair colour with Sonya Dove. Changing hair colour can change what clothes and colours work for them. Suzanne suggests that people get a style review every few years as skin tone and hair colour changes. Marcus asks about make up brands. Suzanne says she works with Colour me beautiful which is a colour based make up brand. She also no 7 recommends No 7. IN terms of make up for photo shoots, Suzanne says neutral is good, don’t go too bright. Chanel have a virtual lipstick app so you can try different colours of lipstick. Marcus says working with a clothing stylist is great for a photographer. Sam says although adding a stylist adds cost to the shoot, it does add a lot of value.Marcus asks if Suzanne could share a women and a man she would like to work with. Suzanne says she’d love to work with Mary Berry. She thinks she could work with Mary’s make up. Suzanne says she’d love to work on Boris Johnson and tidy him up.
“Show Transcription”
Sam: Hi everybody and welcome to Shoot to the Top. Hi Marcus, how are you doing?
Marcus: I’m very well thank you Sam, very well indeed and yeah a big hi to our listeners as well.
Sam: Excellent and we’ve got a very exciting guest today. So today we have Suzanne Southers with us who is a personal stylist. So Suzanne, welcome to the show.
Suzanne: Good morning and thank you for having me.
Sam: It’s great to have you with us and would you like to introduce yourself Suzanne?
Suzanne: Thank you, well I’ve been a stylist, a personal stylist for the last 16 years, helping ladies and men fine-tune their wardrobes and discover what suits them best and what they feel most comfortable and authentic in and it’s great fun and once people learn what actually suits them, what they like wearing, shopping and dressing becomes so much easier for them.
Sam: Excellent, that sounds good. I certainly think, me certainly, I think a lot of men feel that shopping is a painful experience and women as well I imagine and yes it sounds like if people can turn that around and help that would be brilliant.
Suzanne: Definitely and especially since lockdown both ladies and men say to me I don’t like shopping, I haven’t got time and I’m overwhelmed with what’s out there.
Marcus: You obviously bring a lot to the table there Suzanne, I mean 16 years experience is a long time by any measure. What were you doing before that?
Suzanne: Okay well going back to when I was a little girl I was always making clothes for my dolls and then actually became a nurse but after that decided it wasn’t for me, went into fashion, studied fashion and design at the same time and worked with a lot of leading high street brands for ladies and men so then had my own shop and then when that closed, trained to be a stylist.
Sam: Wow, excellent so you’ve been kind of in that whole fashion and clothes for a very long time.
Suzanne: Yes, yes, yes I love it.
Sam: Amazing, so what was your shop? Did that have a kind of speciality?
Suzanne: It was ladies accessories, so handbags, jewellery and a cafe at the same time so it was quite a lot of juggling.
Marcus: Yeah, sounds like it. That’s quite an unusual thing to have isn’t it? I mean obviously these days we saw more of a shopping experience but when you’re talking like 20 years ago maybe there, to have a cafe attached to a shop, that’s an interesting move.
Suzanne: It was, it was quite a baptism of fire into going into business. Yes, it takes a lot of organising, a lot of juggling.
Sam: Yeah, it’s kind of ahead of your time. Funny Marcus, as you were interrupting me to say exactly that, I was thinking exactly that, that’s you know, now it’s quite common isn’t it but that’s quite ahead of its time. Yeah, and did that kind of work well?
Suzanne: It did, yes, yes I worked with my daughter at the time and I think if we did it now we’d do it differently but it was, it was a great, it was a great learning experience and very, very enjoyable.
Sam: Amazing, and so what made you decide to go from the shop to the, to being the personal stylist?
Suzanne: When the lease came to an end I was deciding what to do and my sister-in-law suggested that I make a good personal stylist so I went off and trained with one of the leading brands, worked with them for eight years and then became independent eight years ago.
Marcus: Wow, right, who was it you trained with then? Because I know there’s various schools that offer this service.
Suzanne: Yes, House of Colour down in Watford, as it was then.
Marcus: Yeah, tell us about that course you did there.
Suzanne: Oh it’s brilliant, it was a month so we had to go and stay down there so we learned about finding the colours that suit people, body shapes, how to dress men and women, makeup, how to take people shopping, how to organise wardrobes, yeah about dressing for business, dressing to reflect your own brand so it was very good grounding.
Sam: Amazing, and then who do you tend to work with now? Do you, I know you say you work with all sorts of people, do you have kind of a typical client or do you just work with so many different?
Suzanne: It’s generally business people, 40 plus, I’d say about third men now over the last six months, yes a lot of my clients have been men which is great.
Marcus: Yeah, that is great to hear.
Sam: Because yeah we as men just tend to throw clothes on,
Marcus: I think I genuinely don’t know, I disagree with that.
Suzanne: A lot of blue.
Marcsu: Yeah, I think guys are becoming more aware of the way they look and the importance of dressing, I mean it’s you know it’s always been there, the idea in you know of the dandy, you know that’s been around since Victorian times and men dressing to impress, yeah I don’t think it’s anything that’s unusual.
Suzanne: I think they’re becoming more aware with lockdown and being online so much more, looking at themselves.
Sam: Oh I see, the zoom calls where you’re actually yes, you’re suddenly looking at yourself again. hadn’t thought of that. We have had more time in front of a mirror.
Suzanne: That’s right, yes. I’m becoming a little bored with themselves so I can show them different colours, different styles, different shapes of glasses so they can have more variety when they’re online.
Marcus: We have had previous guests of men’s styles and I’m sure our listeners, if they want to dig into that, can go back and listen to that show, Nick Hems, wasn’t it Sam? Is that right?
Suzanne: Yes, there do seem to be more male stylists out there now too, which is good.
Sam: Yeah, and then obviously we are a photography show so it’s nice to kind of obviously talk about photography. So you’ve got it, you’ve worked with photographers have you, as a stylist?
Suzanne: Yes, yes I have and I work with one photographer in particular, Suzanne Fells, and I help her with a lot of her clients because we find that a lot of people, they’ll book a photo shoot and that they’ll grab a few clothes before the shoot, not think it through and not get the best from their photographs.
Sam: Okay, so you’re kind of helping them to get more value from the shoot by kind of helping them to think about what they go in rather than just the, yeah, what’s in the wardrobe and let’s go.
Suzanne: Yes, definitely, and to choose variety. So I get them to look at their brand colours, if they’re going to put the photographs online, to look whether the clothes they’re wearing are harmonious with their website, and we choose several outfits and I help them to make sure that they’re all organised, they close their eye and everything’s together, so they can arrive stress-free without feeling flustered.
Sam: Yeah, I was going to ask, does that make them kind of feel more relaxed because they’re not having to worry about what they’re wearing in some ways because you’ve helped them choose rather than them feeling slightly self-conscious?
Suzanne: Yes, they’re more in control, yes, and they can reflect how they want to be perceived in business instead of, you know, grabbing things that they’d wear on a Saturday.
Everything’s thought through, which is much more productive.
Marcus: When I was working as a fashion photographer, we’d obviously all the time be working with a clothes stylist as well as many other people, and the clothes stylist would bring in the book, we look at that book and bring in a rail of clothes for us to photograph.
Do you do the same with your clients? Are you working with their existing wardrobe or are you going out and bringing in a new wardrobe?
Suzanne: What we do, I’ll work with them beforehand, we’ll look at what they actually have in their wardrobe, I’ll get them to think, I send a questionnaire, get them to think about how they want to represent themselves, we’ll look at their clothes, then I’ll make suggestions, I can send them a style board that they can click on and buy from, and they can just make additions to their wardrobe, and then we’ll have a Zoom before the shoot to make sure that everything’s organised and they’re happy with what they’re going to wear.
Sam: Okay, so it’s a bit of both, it’s almost what have you got that’ll work, what you can suggest and things that will add to that, so it’s kind of a bit of both.
Suzanne: That’s right, yes, a bit more sustainable.
Marcus: Right, lovely, yeah. And you mentioned that you work with the brown colours, obviously, have you ever got to a situation where you’ve looked at a brown colour and thought, oh my god, that is definitely not your colour palette that we can work with with the clothing, has that ever happened?
Suzanne: Sometimes it’s in opposition to their own colouring, so I try and find a common ground, colours that will harmonise with those colours and still benefit the client.
Sam: Yeah, so they’re not necessarily in their brand colours, but they’re in colours that work with them.
Suzanne: Yes, that harmonise, that’s right, that look good on the eye to the ear.
Sam: And then what are you kind of doing on the, are you on the shoot on the day as well?
Suzanne: No, no, not usually, no, no, I just prepare them and make sure that they feel very happy and confident about their wardrobes, their makeup, their accessories. Then I talk to Suzanne, we have a chat about it all, so we’re both singing from the same hymn page and then hand them over to her because she’s all over the country, so yes, I leave them to it and usually most of the time it’s very successful.
Sam: Excellent, so you’ve kind of shared that with the photographer so the photographer knows kind of what you’ve talked about can kind of help if the client’s a little bit confused, but you’ve also prepared the client so they shouldn’t be confused, they should kind of then have a good idea of what they’re wearing, their different outfits.
Suzanne: Yes, and why they’re wearing them, yes, what they want to say about themselves, yes.
Sam: Okay, that’s really interesting.
Marcus: And so where do you get your inspiration from, Suzanne?
Suzanne: Oh right, I have a look on the internet, I like to look at, my brothers both live in France, so I love to go over there and look at what’s in fashion over there. Yeah, there’s so much on the internet, actually it’s a lot easier to get inspired from what’s out there. I do like to go into shops, I’ll try and go into town once a week and see what’s out there, receive some of the catalogues, some of the magazines.
Marcus: Obviously magazines would have been, in the back of their day, would have been the choice for looking at reference material. Any particular magazines you’re looking at?
Suzanne: I like Grazia, Vogue, GQ for the guys, just to see what’s actually current. But I do say to clients, don’t feel that you have to follow fashion, just work out what’s right for you. And then they can always add modern accessories, like glasses, watches for men, shoes, bags, and jewellery for ladies. So if they have some classic pieces, they can just modernise it with the additions.
Sam: Okay, that makes sense, cool. And then how do you work out what kind of colours would go with people? How does that work as a process?
Suzanne: It’s all to do with your skin tone and your eye colour. We start with the primary colours, because remember at school, mixing the primary colours, the red, yellow and blue.
And there’s only true red that’s got equal amounts of yellow and blue. Every other colour has either got more blue in it or more yellow. You know, if you think about a burgundy red, it’s got more blue in it. Yellow, orangey red has got more yellow in it. And it’s the same with our skin tone, it’s either blue-based or it’s yellow-based. Then we can work out if someone looks better in blue-based colours or yellow-based colours, so that they’re all harmonised together. And then we can choose accessories, clothes, makeup, even hair colour, glasses. So everything works well and brings out, makes them look more visible.
Sam: Yeah, okay.
Marcus: Yeah, and early on you mentioned the word authentic, and of course that’s a big buzzword when you’re building up a personal brand in particular. How do you make sure that people wearing clothes are authentic?
Suzanne: I ask them lots of questions to begin with, to find out what kind of clothes they like to wear. You know, if they love very natural looking clothes, it’s no good trying to put them in very structured clothes, because they won’t do it. Yeah, I ask them about their current wardrobe, their lifestyle. And then as we go through a style session, I’ll ask them how they feel in everything, and just get a good idea of what they like and what they enjoy wearing.
Marcus: Yeah, I mean you can spot it a mile off when someone’s dressed up for a special occasion, like wearing a tie or a suit or whatever. Obviously I’m talking about guys here. And you can see they don’t look comfortable in it, because they’re not used to wearing a suit or a tie.
Suzanne: That’s right, you can see it on things like the BAFTAs and the Oscars. Yeah, some of the great, you know, the big guys. Yeah, they just look really uncomfortable.
Sam: And then have you had photo shoots for yourself, for your business?
Suzanne: I have, yes. Yes, I’ve had several with Suzanne. I’ve got another one during July, and then one in October. Yes.
Sam: So do you kind of do those as a regular thing?
Suzanne: Yes, I do. Yes, I think it keeps, it helps to keep us looking current on our websites. And then when people meet us, they don’t have a surprise that we don’t look like the photographs.
Sam: Yeah, no, that’s amazing. So that’s amazing, because I think lots of people do, don’t they? They either don’t do the professional photography or do a one-off and then, you know, leave it. And like you say, you kind of look at the photo and then you meet and like, oh, yeah, that’s not quite true anymore.
Suzanne: That’s right. And then with having a range of photographs, we can use them on social media, all the social media platforms and still look authentic.
Sam: Yeah, yeah.
Marcus: Got it. Okay, let’s move on now for some tips for photographers that maybe you might be able to pass on. Obviously, there’s a lot involved, but maybe you can give us one, a couple of things or three things that maybe I can work with or other photographers can use as information?
Suzanne: Ask your clients or work out how many outfits your client is going to have. Get them to make sure they’re very organised. They’ve got everything they need for the day. Everything’s ironed, clean and ironed. They’ve got all the accessories that they need. Take them in a bag that won’t make them crease. Give themselves plenty of time before they start the shoot to do their hair, their makeup and just calm down a little bit before they actually start. I’d say the secret is in the planning, the preparation.
Marcus: Okay, so lots of planning. Get things sorted out. What about colour-wise? What kind of rough gauge could you go for?
Suzanne: Okay. Some of the bright, some of the universal colours are teal, that’s a good colour. Coral, that’s quite a universal colour. A lot of the lighter colours like cream, white can look a bit washed out on people in a photograph.
Marcus: They do, that’s very true.
Suzanne: So darker colours tend to carry more authority but not necessarily black. It could be grey, navy, dark green, dark purple, your jumper. And a jacket. Even if they don’t regularly wear a jacket, if they can have one shoot in a jacket, if they’re in business, it just tends to give a little bit more authority.
Marcus: 100%, good advice. I think, especially when I’m working with clients and maybe just doing headshots, the one thing I always hate is when you’ve got… because you’re cropping in quite close in the photograph to the head, obviously being a headshot, and if you have an opening on the jacket or a shirt or something or a blouse and so the skin is exposed or whatever on the jacket, I really hate that and I really try and avoid that with my clients. I always make sure they have a button up the jacket or have a scarf or something just to give a border to that bottom edge.
Suzanne: That’s a good idea because it might not actually look professional once it’s produced, if they’re showing too much skin.
Marcus: Especially when you’re cropping in tight.
Suzanne: Yes, yes.
Sam: So you have to nick a spare cravat everywhere.
Suzanne: Yes.
Marcus: I’ve got quite a lot of cravats, it’s not too difficult. So, okay, so we’re talking about some great tips about colour there and preparation and you mentioned a thing that I, or when I’m working, I tend to style my clients myself. I’m really into clothing and so I’m and I always have been for donkey’s donkey’s years, maybe even longer than yourself. But the thing that I always look for, as you say, is eye colour. I think when you look at someone’s eye colour, you can work out what colour will go with them quite easily.
Suzanne: That’s right, yes. And often the brighter the eye colour, the brighter the clothes they can wear.
Marcus: Oh, that’s interesting. I never thought that. That’s very interesting.
Suzanne: Yeah. Someone like Jamie Oliver in Prince Harry with the bright eyes, the brighter hair, they can often take the turquoises, the brighter, you may have the brighter yellows, brighter blues, because it won’t actually overpower them. They’ve got quite a strong colouring already.
Marcus: Yes, indeed. And sorry, you also advise your clients about the makeup as well, mainly for women.
Suzanne: Yes. Yes, once we know whether they’re yellow based, their skin tone is yellow based or blue based, I can advise them on makeup, which shades to go for. And also hair colour, because hair colour works in the same way.
Marcus: Oh, well, I mean, obviously, I’ve got to get straight in there and talk about hair colour and talk about our previous guest. If anyone wants to check it out, Sonia Dove, who was the creative director of Wella, was in our previous shows, and she’s obviously a hair colour expert. And we had a great chat with her about getting into hair photography.
But yes, I’m sorry to mention that one, our previous show.
Sam: Yeah, put that in the notes as well as all the other things. So you could almost people.
So I mean, could it work almost if you were talking to people and say, well, this will work with you if they say, well, what if I change my hair colour? You go, well, if you dyed your hair, this colour, actually, these different things could work. Can it work like that? So people could change their hair and kind of change what works?
Suzanne: Yes, it does. And actually, some clients have worked with for a long time, and they’ve decided to go grey over the over lockdown. And it’s interesting that they can actually wear stronger colours still within the same palette, but stronger colours. Yeah. So I suggest to the clients that they have a colour review, maybe two years down the line. Yeah. Because as we mature, our skin tone lightens.
Sam: Okay. Yeah.
Marcus: So our palette change is okay.
Suzanne: Yes. Yeah. Yeah.
Sam: I’m interested in the idea of choosing to go grey, Mark. I don’t know about you, but it seemed to happen at the time for me.
Marcus: I’m not quite grey yet. I’m a bit pepper pot. But I am quite looking forward to go grey. I’ve always looked forward to going grey. So yeah. On the makeup side we’re talking about, do you recommend any particular types of makeup? The reason I say this, Suzanne, is I have a particular bugbear that commercial or high street makeup has a really strong red base to it. And for photography, that just is a real killer.
Suzanne: I work with a brand, Colour Me Beautiful, which is actually made to go with colour analysis. So they have the blue base colours, the yellow base colours. I do actually, I’m quite fond of Number 7 because they’ve done a lot of research and they have a, they can analyse what colour foundation to wear. They’ll advise on what lipsticks.
Marcus: But particularly for photography though, particularly makeup for photography or colours.
Suzanne: OK. I’d say keep it fairly neutral. Don’t go really bright for photographs, for a photo shoot. Often if someone is more blue based, they’ll suit a pink lipstick. If someone is yellow based, they’ll suit a coral lipstick. So that’s quite a good, a good starting place. And things like the Chanel, the brand, they do, they actually, you can actually upload a photograph of yourself or do it virtually and then try on different lipsticks to see which works.
Sam: Virtual lipstick trying.
Suzanne: That’s right, yes. And there are apps where you can try hair colour as well.
Sam: Excellent. Maybe, Marcus, maybe we should go for some purple and blue or something. Have a bit of variety.
Marcus: I don’t think so. Yes. Yeah, yeah, it’s great. You’ve got some really good advice there actually. And I think it’s great to work with a stylist, I have to say, and they can take over all these problems. But if you’re not lucky enough to do that, or there’s no budget for it, it’s great to pass those tips on.
Sam: But I guess in some ways, what you’ve been saying, Suzanne, is that although it costs more to add a stylist, because the client has to pay for a photographer and a stylist in some ways, they get more from the photo shoot, because they’re more likely to get a result that actually they’re going to like and they’re going to use the photos from rather than when maybe they go along, you say they’ve grabbed some clothes, they get to the end and then look at the photos. And they’re not quite sure what if they’ve worked with the stylist first. So there’s that upfront cost, it probably means the photos are actually going to be more useful, more better and have more longevity.
Suzanne: Definitely. And with Suzanne, a lot of her clients will find 18 outfits. So as long as they’re very organised, they’ll have a huge range of photographs that they’ll be able to use on lots of social media platforms and just have lots of variety.
Sam: Now that’s amazing, that many in a photo. I was thinking you were talking two or three outfits, that many. So that’s loads of variety, tons of different looks.
Suzanne: If it’s a day shoot, yes. Suzanne and I work together with the client so that they can quickly get changed because everything, every outfit is compiled. And I also get clients to take photographs of each outfit with their accessories, their makeup, so that they’re very organised and know what to choose from, should they forget in the day.
Sam: So on the day, it’s nice and simple.
Suzanne: Yes, that’s it.
Sam: That makes sense. Cool. Okay.
Marcus: I mean, that’s brilliant. And maybe just as you’re coming to the end of the show, maybe Suzanne, you could just maybe just share with us, maybe a woman and a man that you would love to work with.
Suzanne: Oh, a woman and a man. Right. Let me think about this. Let’s think of a woman. To be honest, I love Mary Berry, but they do tend to put lots of black eyeliner on her, lots of black around her eyes. So I’d love to do her makeup because she wears fabulous colours. I’d just like to soften it a little bit so that she could be a real role model for more mature ladies. Just off the top of my head. Because I think a lot of women do wear a lot of black around their eyes and it can look a little bit harsh. And then let’s think of a man. Oh, I’d love to have a go at Boris Johnson, see what we could do with him.
Sam: That’s a job and a heart. That would definitely be a project.
Marcus: Yeah, but in spite of that, his brand is super strong, isn’t it? Because he’s known for being a bad dresser and a bad actor.
Suzanne: Yes, yes. Yeah. Yeah. Bumbling. And we remember him for that.
Sam: Yeah. Cool. Well, thank you so much, Suzanne. It’s been really interesting talking to you. All sorts of useful stuff there for our photographers and listeners. Thank you so much for taking the time. If anyone wants to get in touch, where are the best places to find you? Online.
Suzanne: My website is very easy. It’s SuzanneSuthers.com. Suzanne Suthers on LinkedIn. Suzanne Sothers styling on Instagram.
Sam: So perfect. And we’ll put all of those links in the show notes so people can find you. Thank you so much for your time. It’s been amazing having you here. For people, for all listeners, we’ve got the Shoot to the Top newsletter, which you can subscribe to on the website. And if you subscribe, you get the show in your inbox every week. So you never forget to show. That’s the most important part. You get extra tips from me and Marcus.
You get past shows that some of you might have missed. You get extra bits of information, all sorts of stuff. So well worth signing up to. And if you think you would like to be a guest on the show, then if you go to the website, you can also apply to be a guest and we would love to hear from you. So thank you, Suzanne.
Suzanne: Thank you. Thank you for having me.
Sam: It’s been amazing. And Marcus, I will see you next week.
Marcus: Yeah, thanks, Suzanne. And see you next week, Sam. Take care.
